New Stalin list

[60buick]

I finally played my Stalin list. This is what I ran

1 IS-2 HQ w/ AA MG

3 IS-2 all w/ AA MG

3 IS-2 all w/ AA MG

3 IS-2 all w/ AA MG

sapper company with one platoon and supply truck

I do not like it at all. The IS-2's have a big weakness and this list makes it that much easier for the enemy to exploit that weakness to their advantage. Plus the list has zero flexibility. I have always played Americans which are very flexible so I can see how much it hurts the Stalin list.

The IS-2 is a very good tank but it's Achilles heal is going to be bigger armour like the King Tiger and Jagdpanther. You can't out maneuver them, you can't flank them and their rounds go through you like tin foil. If the terrain is tight so you can't mass your fire. If they have a good smoke asset you are done. You can only duel it out and bleed hoping to roll better. Both big German tank guns are common at tournaments and most players have smoke. Even Tiger ones can give you a bad day, you had just better roll better than the opposing player. And if they have infantry You have a bad day, while you are playing "Patty Cake" with the armour they can waltz over to the objective and take it in a Mobile battle. Mobile battles are death to a Stalin tank company because you do not have enough to cover the back door while trying to knock down there front door. You can sit there and die or hope they sit and let you pound them for ten turns.

The IS-2 is not a good enough tank to take ten and cram them down someones throat and win. You have to play them very smart, that means some kind of combined arms.


So I am rethinking the list.

My list consisted of a small sapper platoon that was only good for protecting one objective and 3 tanks to guard another hopefully having line of sight to the Sapper team to lend a hand. I also have my hammer of seven Stalins to do some damage.


I MUST have my hammer

1 IS-2 HQ w/ AA MG--------160

3 IS-2 all w/ AA MG---------485

3 IS-2 no AA-----------------470


I also MUST beef up my Sappers..........
so lets double them


sapper company with two platoons and supply truck---235


Now do I need 470 points guarding one objective? NO, It is nice to have 3 more tanks waiting to take the place of burning tanks but I intend to remedy that plus it is tough to get all ten in position at one time I think the points could be better used. Lets get some Air Planes to help my other 7 Stalins deal with big armour. I saw some AT 11 Stuka's burn several Stalins tonight so I need Air to either combat the Stuka's or to kill tanks helping me conserve my 7 IS-2's. Air power is also a must in dealing with the trenches that are getting popular.

I MUST have some air.

Limited II-2m tip 3m shturmovik-----225


Now that I have some points freed up I need my fourth platoon to guard my remaining objective. AA, useless in anything but defence...... Rockets are what I need and I can add AA trucks in the mix. They should keep infantry off my objective while the rockets can only aid my Stalins in their assault.

I went with
2 Rocket Mortor platoons with the AA platoon---175

So the final list looks like

HQ
1 IS-2= 155
+AA= 5

Tank Platoon
3 IS-2's =470
+AA= 15

Tank Platoon
3 IS-2's =470

Guards Sapper Company
2 platoons= 210
Supply truck= 25

Guards Rocket Mortor battalion
2 platoons= 135
AA platoon= 40

Limited air Support
Tip 3M Shturmovik= 225


Now in a Mobile battle I have my 7 tank hammer with the AT 12 air planes to kill infantry or big tanks while rockets pin and my objectives are more secure.

In a Defensive battle I am only down 3 tanks but have an 11 stand pioneer platoon capable of an assault with rocket and air support and some mobile machine guns.

Let me know what you think of this list I like it a lot.


I was also thinking about dropping the supply truck and giving all tanks AA and giving one platoon of Rockets extra crew or upgrading the AA to 37mm. Any ideas?

[Tiger505]

I like it =) just not sure how 7 Stalins will do vs armor

[60buick]

I think 7 will be plenty as long as you roll average for air and can kill a few heavy's. AT 12 cannons are nasty. Also don't underestimate the 11 stand Sappers, tank assault 4 is pretty good against top armour one. I tweaked the list a little more.


The expanded crews on the rockets free up points while giving the opponet fewer tagets and having the same punch. I can add a few tank riders on my HQ tank making it a little more nasty in case someone decieds to assault it. I also have nastier AA trucks and AA MG's on all my tanks which I feel is very important.

I think this list is finished I just need to see how it works.


HQ
1 IS-2= 155
+AA= 5
Tankodesantniki SMG team= 15

Tank Platoon
3 IS-2's =470
+AA= 15

Tank Platoon
3 IS-2's =470
+AA= 15

Guards Sapper Company
2 platoons= 210
Supply truck= 25

Guards Rocket Mortor battalion
1 platoons= 85
Upgraded crews= 10
AA platoon= 40
Upgraded to 37mm= 10

Limited air Support
Tip 3M Shturmovik= 225

[60buick]

Had to change some stuff. The list worked very well against the pioneers list but I see a few ways to shave points.


HQ
1 IS-2= 155
+AA= 5
Tankodesantniki SMG team= 15

Tank Platoon
3 IS-2's =470
+AA= 15

Tank Platoon
3 IS-2's =470
+AA= 15

Guards Sapper Company
2 platoons= 210

Guards Rocket Mortor battalion
2 platoons= 135
Upgraded crews= 20
AA platoon= 40

Limited air Support
Shturmovik= 200


1740 points

[cephian]

What was the result of the compaign against the Ersatz?

[dagrinch]

for this last list. If you don't mind a suggestion. Drop the tanko from the HQ and get a pioneer supply wagon/truck. If you have to defend the fortification could make a difference and could allow you to re-roll dig ins for the sappers and the kats battery (infantry and AA guns only effected)

Just a thought

[60buick]

I like the supply truck but in all the games I have used the list I have never been able to use it. Plus in the tourny only 2 of the missions allow it and I am armour so odds are I will be attacking. It was a toss up, very helpful fortifications once in a blue moon or an extra assault swing and 3 SMG dice all the time. I also considered leaving keeping the bigger cannon on the planes but I figure anything with armour weak enough to make AT 12 cannons more valuable than AT 6 rockets can't hurt my Stalins. I like the way the tankos look and maybe it will help me get best army....I won't get best general.


The Stalins did very well against the engineers.


I did get hurt in turn one. I moved a Stalin platoon out and engaged his tigers flubbing every roll. His tigers and Hummel's rolled very well bailing one and killing two. I bailed back in but was unable to move . the tank had perfect view of the middle of the table so anytime he tried to head toward the other objective I would shoot. The planes helped. Flying tank is nice. If you roll 3 planes AA doesn't matter. I rolled 3 and flew right into his 8 AA dice and only lost one plane. Then I bailed 2 Hummel's and an AA truck.
One turn I was able to pin with my planes then assault with the Sappers and completely kill one infantry platoon putting me on the objective which was pulled 2 turns later as 3 tigers, 3 Hummel's and a second infantry platoon killed off the sappers. As he focused on driving me off of the objective, I sent 4 Stalins and the AA trucks into the other objective and assaulted another platoon of engineers completely dividing his force. Even with tank assault 5 and flamethrowers I didn't lose one tank. The IS-2 does very well in the assault roll. Only 2 stands survived and managed to unpin contesting the objective on turn 7. I lost but not by much.

[cephian]

WHAT?? Hold the horses Firsttofight had Tigers and Hummels in his Ersatz list? Sounds like it was a good game, can't wait to see both lists on the table!

[scoutsout]

Yeah...but I have to say...he didn't deploy his minefields in the best manner. If he'd covered the approach from the hill on his right...you'd of had a heck'uva time getting off that assault. In addition...if the platoon in the middle had moved towards his left...He'd have probably been able to truly put the hurting on the tanks over there.

Alan played a good game. If he was more experienced with that list I think you would have had a much harder time accomplishing anything.

Just my two centavos,

David